Weird Studies/Patreon/Cybernetics

16 Sep 2024 - 27 Aug 2025
Open in Logseq
    • Finally got around to the WS Cybernetics patreon episode and they namechecked me first thing, and the first topic is the intention (or lack therof) in meditation.
      • Cool to be namechecked! I think there's a bit of confusion around the meaning of "cybernetics", which can refer to a specific interdisciplinary field that thrived in the 1940s-1960s but is now largely moribund, or the more general transformation of society by electronic and digital technology, which started off before then and of course is still going strong. These aren't the same thing although they are of course closely related.
      • I learned recently that the field of artificial intelligence was created and named partly to put some distance between the founders and cybernetics (not sure if the differences were personal or intellectual, probably both). The cybernetics movement may have been just too weird for academia and all that sweet military funding.
      • The stuff about purpose in meditation
      • Cybernetics proper is more about self-control; how do organisms or systems autonomously control themselves.
      • Cybernetics as a weird science – too weird, which is why it sort of died off.
      • I dislike the conflation of cybernetics with technology, although maybe that's a lost cause. Like the example of Mark Zuckerberg screwing around the meaning of "friend" – I've written about this Omniorthogonal: Engineers of Human Souls and agree there is something creepy and awful going on there, and you can blame tech if you want, but I think its wrong to blame cybernetics.
      • Bateson was all about importing cybernetics into the human realm. He is mentioned in episode.
      • Humans are machines, sorry. Or – rather, they are machines in part and we should celebrate and investigate that part.
      • I was wondering when you guys would talk about the difference between JFM Catholicism and Zen in relation to the self.
      • ref: Zen Action, Zen Person
      • Cybernetics as expansive rather than reductive
      • Bateson cybernetics of self, AA, man with cane